Mackie Onyx 1640i or two MOTU 8pre + Mixer?

Berberman

Berberman

New member
What I am trying to do:
a)Record a full band, need 10 mic inputs + a few instrument inputs.
b)Be able to provide easy setup solution for guitar, bass and voice to go through monitors for quick rehearsals/jams with band.

What I currently have:
Software: Logic Pro
Audio Interface: Presonus Firepod that I am getting rid of via Ebay soon.

My dilema/options:

-One of my options would be to get a Mackie Onyx 1640i , which would provide me with a 16 mic input firewire audio interface for recording, as well as provide me with Aux outs to send to the PA speakers when rehearsing.

-As far as I understand setting up an appropriate flow path for what I want to do, I could also get two MOTU 8 pre (or 2 Presonus Firestudios) daisy chained together for 16 mic inputs for recording, and buy a seperate, cheap analog mixer for the band to plug into the PA. This would be the cheaper route I guess.

I am curious to see what everyone thinks about these two options, if they are viable options and if there may be other options I did not consider..How would YOU do it.
 
If you are not doing live sound I would not buy a mixer unless I were going to use it for mixing. I understand that it has the firewire for A/D conversion, but it does not have 16 channels of D/A conversion.

My answer would be both an interface and a mixer for mixing out of the box. I you know that you are only going to mix in software I would just buy stand alone mic pre's and a interface.
 
gcapel said:
I understand that it has the firewire for A/D conversion, but it does not have 16 channels of D/A conversion.
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Could you explain this to me? I'm not sure what it would mean as far as my setup goes.

The Onyx 1460i being the pricier option, I am now considering one MOTU 8PRE and a cheap Behringer ADA8000 for 8 extra mic Ins. Both new would run me around $800. In time I would get an analog mixer to my rig so the band can plug intno the PA.
 
Adding a hardware mixer to one or more 8pres is not a cost-effective improvement. The 8pres ship with perfectly adequate software mixers, and whatever you are using for a DAW will have plenty of mixing options anyway. Adding a mixer only gives you physical faders to work with, but also layers an additional preamp, pots and EQ stages. There is also no reason why you couldn't use the outputs on the 8Pre(s) set to directly monitor the inputs, and then route a submix to a power amp for PA purposes.
 
Adding the ADA8000 via the ADAT connector would give you 16 seperate recording inputs. Same as using 2 8pre's. This is a good low cost alternative to having 2 8pre's. This will work fine for what you want to do. I use the 8pre, and it's great.
 
ermghoti said:
Adding a hardware mixer to one or more 8pres is not a cost-effective improvement. The 8pres ship with perfectly adequate software mixers, and whatever you are using for a DAW will have plenty of mixing options anyway. Adding a mixer only gives you physical faders to work with, but also layers an additional preamp, pots and EQ stages. There is also no reason why you couldn't use the outputs on the 8Pre(s) set to directly monitor the inputs, and then route a submix to a power amp for PA purposes.
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This is the peice of information I was looking for. i have to look into the 8pre's software mixers and how I would set it up to send a signal to the PA. I just lost a bid on ebay on an onyx 1640 + firewire card that went for $960. I guess that's good because I'll go the cheaper route: 8pre +ada8000.
 
braden_ said:
how about a yamaha n12?
http://www.sweetwater.com/store/detail/n12
seems like it would fit the bill while being in the ballpark for money.
Click to expand...

The n12 ony has 8 mic inputs? Which I already had on my firepod before I sold it. I'm realy looking for 9 mics for drums, a mic for guitar, a mic for bass and a mic input for voice which brings my needs to 12 mic inputs. Besides, correct me if I am wrong but the n12 does not have Adat to connect a peice of equipment with more channels such as the behringer ada&8000.
 
You have a hell of alot more options with the mixer. I use a Mackie 1640 firewire and love it. The 1640i just adds a few more options. You can use the Aux channels on the mixer (6 of them) to send 6 independant headphone mixes to the musicians. You have Monitor and Headphone control, you have a tape in and out which is nice. Use the main outs to supply a mix to the live room. You can send whatever instrument is needed into the live room. The possibilities are far greater than with say a firepod. Also with the 1640i you now have the option of tapping the firewire signal either at the preamp or after the eq, which is a nice feature on the new model. I can modify mine to do that with a few wires soldered, but I like the clean signal taken at the preamp. But if you want to utilize the Perkins Eq (which is fantastic) into the send then you can. Plus you get 16 Onyx preamps which are among some of the best. Just google reviews on the preamps and see what the pros say.
 
Berberman said:
Could you explain this to me? I'm not sure what it would mean as far as my setup goes.

The Onyx 1460i being the pricier option, I am now considering one MOTU 8PRE and a cheap Behringer ADA8000 for 8 extra mic Ins. Both new would run me around $800. In time I would get an analog mixer to my rig so the band can plug intno the PA.
Click to expand...

Well, you can mix in software or you can mix on an actual mixer. In order to mix on an analog mixer you have to convert your digital tracks on your pc to analog signals. The onyx will only give you two channels of Digital to Analog conversion. You are covered on the a/d conversion with all 16 tracks.

I would get the mixer reguardless. You can get started with it. If you decide to upgrade your conversion you can still use the onyx for mixing and monitoring.

The Allen & Heath zed 16R console will give you 16 channels of conversion both ways. I don't know about stability issues on either of these desk.
 
I decided to go with a MOTU 8pre and a Behringer ADA8000 via ADAT, giving me 16 mic inputs. Reason I didn't go with the Mackie is that their customer service sucks from what I've been reading and their support for drivers is even worse.
Thanks all for the valuable info.
 
gcapel said:
Well, you can mix in software or you can mix on an actual mixer. In order to mix on an analog mixer you have to convert your digital tracks on your pc to analog signals. The onyx will only give you two channels of Digital to Analog conversion. You are covered on the a/d conversion with all 16 tracks.

I would get the mixer reguardless. You can get started with it. If you decide to upgrade your conversion you can still use the onyx for mixing and monitoring.

The Allen & Heath zed 16R console will give you 16 channels of conversion both ways. I don't know about stability issues on either of these desk.
Click to expand...

Look I record through a Phonic Helix 24. I am considering buying the Mackie for name only. (maybe Pre amps) I get amazing recordings and all my musician friends agree I am getting the best quality recordings around. (do mostly to room acoustics and know how) but

I really would never do this with anything but a firewire (or usb) mixer, and here is why.

You are mixing on the mixer for monitoring..... all the sound goes into the computer un messed with.

It is really easy to get all the monitoring right on a big mix board with knobs and sliders than to mess around in software. Period

Plus
you have a mixer to do live stuff if you want
 
gcapel said:
Well, you can mix in software or you can mix on an actual mixer. In order to mix on an analog mixer you have to convert your digital tracks on your pc to analog signals. The onyx will only give you two channels of Digital to Analog conversion. You are covered on the a/d conversion with all 16 tracks.
Click to expand...

I think you're generalising far too much about USB/Firewire mixers to yourself... not all of them just send the stereo mix to the computer. The Mackie is one example which does act as a proper multi-channel interface.
 
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